This is a topic dear to my heart.
Being a non-religious family, we have always chosen for our children to opt out of NSW public schools’ religious education program (or scripture) once a week at school.
The current laws on this, state that non-scripture children are not to receive any instruction or teachings during this scripture period, as it would give non-scripture children an ‘unfair advantage’ over the children who do attend scripture. When a child begins school, if parents do not give the school notice of their intention to opt out, their child is automatically placed into scripture classes by default.
I’d like to start this piece back in 1979. This was my first year of school. To this point, I was five years old, and knew nothing at all about religion. My father is an atheist, my mother was raised catholic but was by now non religous herself. My brother and I were raised as atheists. The first time that year that scripture classes started, I was placed into a catholic scripture class, most likely because the school had some knowledge of my mother’s catholic upbringing.
I sat in that class, and was handed colourful colouring-in/workbooks with some bearded man in robes on the front cover. They made us do something with our hands, saying, ‘in the name of the father, the son, and the holy spirit, amen’. To say I was clueless about what the heck any of it meant would be a glaring understatement.
Anyway. I took these books they gave me home. My father hit the roof. He was very angry at these brightly coloured books I’d been given. It became clear that I was never to go back to that class again. I had no idea what all the fuss was about. From then on, instead of going to scripture, I would sit in the principal’s office and read, sometimes by myself, and other times out loud to a teacher or the principal. I was already an outstanding reader before I started school, so I really didn’t get a great deal out of it. I was the only one in my school who did not attend scripture. That was fine with me.
Once I hit second grade, my parents must’ve decided that I was old enough to make up my own mind, because by then I started attending the church of England scripture classes instead. I kind of didn’t get the point of those classes, really…
So let’s move back to how it is today, raising our children in a religion-free family. My eldest daughter, in the past four years attended a public school in Sydney. We opted her out of the scripture program. She was placed into an overcrowded classroom with a relief teacher. Children were allowed to choose one box of toys from their class and bring it to the classroom, and they would play during non-scripture. By the time my daughter was in second grade, non scripture was so crowded, it needed to be moved to the school hall to accommodate all the students who were now opting out of scripture.
Now we’ve moved to a small country town, and, just like her mother, my daughter is the only child at school not attending scripture classes. This doesn’t bother her, and it doesn’t bother us, her parents. What does bother me, is that despite my request that she still be supervised and looked after, this, going by my daughter’s reports, does not happen. She is left in a room in the office with no supervision. She once asked them, ‘but what if something happens to me?’ To which she was told, ‘scream, we’ll hear you’. Not nearly good enough.
So, knowing that St James Ethics Centre in conjunction with the NSW Federation of P and C associations has requested to do a trial of an ethics based, non religious alternative class for students who don’t attend scripture, I am one excited mother. It irks the hell out of me that my daughter, and us parents have to rush around like mad things getting her ready for school on time, only for her to be not taught anything first thing in the morning, once a week. It peeves me even more that as far as I know, she is not being adequately supervised. (Yes, I do intend to discuss this with the school)
As parents, we teach our child ethics and morals in the home. But we support this program, as we feel that whilst our daughter is at school, she should be learning useful, worthwhile things. Not being plonked off to one side with a book thrown at her. (And like her mum, she was also already an outstanding reader long before she began school)
Oddly, the catholic church, and some other christians, oppose this trial taking place, and possibly becoming a part of schools.
So, I wanted to make people aware of this by writing about it, and providing those who are interested in supporting this, with some links on how they can show support.
There is a facebook ‘like’ page
You can visit the St James Ethics Centre’s website about special ethics education
And last, but not at all least, here is a list of the email address of all NSW state parliamentarians. The Australian Christian Lobby (ACL) Group has been doing this, and their numbers are huge. I urge anyone who feels strongly about this to please write to all of them and voice how you feel about it. I shall be doing the same.
I’d also love to hear other peoples’ opinions on this
Note: please do not attack the ideas/spiritual beliefs of anyone here, I believe if we are mature, we can all have a civilised discussion about this.
I’m very excited about this too. I remember once being asked by a teacher what religion I was and answering “None.” She asked me again, I answered, and she said “I’ll just put you down as C of E shall I?”
The system here is a bit different, Religious Instruction is at the discretion of the Principal and is usually only once or twice a term, but there is no way my daughter will be attending. I’ve already checked out what I can see of the proposed curriculum online, and I am preparing to offer to teach ethics classes. I’m a qualified teacher, although not currently registered, so I’m hoping I can start it as a small experiment.
I don’t see that there is any place at all in schools for scripture type lessons. Comparative religions and cultures are part of the SOSE curriculum, this is just Churches taking advantage of a captive audience. Surely parents should be the ones teaching their children about their beliefs, not some people with who knows what training and background who happen to be chosen by the local church.
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I feel much the same, Deb. I am more than happy to teach my children theology, but we choose not to allow our children to be taught about this subject in such a way that they would be ‘preached’ to or given a biased account.
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Wow!! I am shocked that your daughter is left unsupervised. I’m in Canada and our public system has no religious component. Other than a Christmas/Hannukah sing. There is public Catholic schools available. This is a bit of an issue. Tax money supports these schools but not other denominational schools.
I like your “if we are mature” note.
I’m actually quite surprised that public schools there still teach theology. Religion has been out of all public schools here in Canada for years. I attended a private Catholic School for the first few elementary grades in the early 80s but when I switched to regular private school, religion was not taught or allowed to be taught.
I would consider my family as being Christian and I wouldn’t have a problem with theology being taught in public school but I don’t see how it could be taught without teaching all of the major world religions. A sort of primer on religion (or non religion). Since that doesn’t seem to be happening, I don’t think religion belongs in the public school system. Private schools – sure – but not public.
And to not supervise your daughter is unbelievably irresponsible of them!
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Kristin and Marilyn, that’s interesting to hear how Canadian schools differ with religious education. Makes me realise how behind our country, or should I say state, is
In Tassie, we don’t do the religious education, unless you send your child to a church run private school. I wouldn’t be happy to have my child in scripture classes anyway – theology yes, we’ll talk theology when she is older, but please, don’t preach to her.
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Veronica, I’m starting to think we’ve picked the wrong state to live in! And my approach to theology is the same as yours, by the sounds of it
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I completely agree. I’ve always thought is was wrong to leave students who don’t want religious education to sit and twiddle their thumbs, that is not education. I won’t even go into whether school is the place for religious education (as opposed to studying religions as part of cultural studies).
I was also disturbed when enrolling my son to be asked permission for him to see the chaplain. I understand this is not in a religious context, but for a counselling-type role if needed, but why is this role performed by a religious organisation (they offer the service to the school, otherwise the school would have nothing).
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I’ve heard about these chaplaincy type things in schools before, Catherine. I don’t think we’ve ever been at a school that has one, so I don’t know as much about it as you do. Personally, I would prefer a regular school counsellor for sure
Hear Mum Roar´s last post ..Trial to make SRE time fairer for non religious students
My children attend the local Catholic primary school as I wanted religion to be part of their education – that was my choice. I can completely understand your frustration at your child not being supervised during the religious education time, it simply isn’t good enough. I am pretty sure the state schools here in Victoria have something similar to the opt out system that NSW. Like the others before me, I am actually quite surprised that they still teach it in state schools now and would have thought with the breadth of religious beliefs in this country, it would not be appropriate to stick to mainly Christian based religions.
I think studying ethics would be fantastic for all kids and would encourage my school to introduce it into the curriculum.
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It is good to hear how other states (and countries of course) are doing, it Planning Queen, so thanks for mentioning how it’s done in Victoria.
Yes, it is frustrating, and it baffles me that in this day and age, the needs/beliefs of all cannot be taken into consideration.
Hear Mum Roar´s last post ..Trial to make SRE time fairer for non religious students
What irks me is that religious leaders say that no other people/organisations are capable of teaching values – which is a load of hog wash. There are millions on non-believers who lead ethical lives and contribute enormously in the community.
I am lucky enough that the school my daughter attends will be having the ethics trial in year 5 and 6.
My daughter in kindy was a non-scripture where 93% of the school students are but got bored and has now opted into anglican scripture. I am fine with that she is really enjoying it, and loves chanting God is our saviour and talking about angels. But the big question is why do all male scripture teachers have beards?
Reality Raver, I think it is great that non religious people are slowly becoming accepted as capable of being moral, ethical, and all-round ‘good’ by the community. I’d love to hear how your school’s trial goes! How exciting!
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I think it is completely unacceptable that they think screaming is a valid substitute for adult supervision. I find it really hard to believe that the school can’t find something constructive for children who are not religious to do during that time frame.
Although, I went to religious classes at school and even though I don’t believe the teachings now, I value that I was able to learn about it and make my choice in part from that. Religion is interesting to study, even if you don’t agree with it.
BTW, thanks for stopping by .
Suburban Princess, I agree, I do want my kids to learn about religion, as I find it a fascinating topic. For me, I don’t feel that scripture is the environment I want my kids doing that in. I’d rather they learn about all of the religions from a non biased method. And whichever way they go, I definitely think they’re too young to decide for now.
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Wow, I am gobsmacked! For all the grief we get here in the States about mixing religion with politics we would never, NEVER, try to teach scripture in the public schools with public funding. It just would not be tolerated. We’re at a point where we can barely squeeze all the really important educational material into the curriculum. I can’t imagine how kids would have the time to study something like this when it seems clearly beyond the realm of the state to teach. Our public schools are a mess right now, I’m not defending them, but truly, I had no idea that clergy were teaching scripture in public schools in Australia. I hardly know what to say.
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Wow, Kristin, I find it interesting that this wouldn’t be tolerated in your country. Food for thought…
‘Scream, we’ll hear you’?? Um, I don’t think so!
Reading this post, I was thinking – but kids need to know about religion – however, reading the comments I think I just misunderstood the term ‘Scripture’ classes.
My daughter is still a toddler, so I don’t have any experience with this yet. But I know how I want her educated about religion, and it actually sounds quite similar to your wishes (now that I think I’ve clarified the terms in my mind!). That is, I want her to learn about a variety of religions – what they believe, why, how they practice those beliefs, etc. because I think knowledge equals understanding, acceptance and respect.
BUT I don’t want her being taught what to believe in. I would want her to have an unbiased account of different religions and then, if she ever chooses to become part of one or to follow certain beliefs, that is her decision. All I would ask of her would be to make an informed decision.
Yet I went to Catholic schools and was taught ‘YOU believe in this, this and this’. It just never sat well with me, even as a young child. It felt wrong. I want to approach things differently with my daughter.
That’s the wish-list anyway – not sure how it works in schools here in Victoria. I guess I’ll find out in a few years!
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When my son started school three years ago, our school offered ‘non-denominational’ Religious Education classes – which was basically Christian Scripture classes. Considering the diverse ethnic and religious makeup of our area, I thought this was pretty offensive.
These days it’s more accurately known as ‘Christian Religious Education’. I’d like to say that this is because I wrote angry-yet-articulate letters to the school council instead of bitching vaguely about it in the playground at school pick-up time. But no.
Both my children have been ‘opted out’ of these classes. I’d be very happy for them to get an overview of the world’s religions – you know, in a truly ecumenical Religious Education course – but alas, that’s not on offer.
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Megan, that’s pretty much how I feel about it. Above all, I want my children to go to school to learn something, lol! Read Planning Queen’s comment above, she’s a Victorian:) Might give some idea of how it’s done
NDM, same here, I’m more than happy for my children to learn about a broad range of religions to promote tolerance, awareness, understanding, and to give them an opportunity to choose down the track should they wish to do so in an informed way
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When I moved from Tassie to Victoria I was surprised to know that religious ed was an opt out, not an opt in class. My kids school has the basic Holier Than Thou approach. I am not interested in this for my children. Interestingly, a school about 1/2 an hours drive away has opted to use Bahai as the religious teaching they offer, due to the make up of ethnicity at the school.
I would be so much happier for a class on religions, where a range of religions were studied, or ethics.
Other than that, I have told my kids if they have questions about religion they can ask me. It’s the best option I have for them right now.
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Yes, theology classes, about all the religions seem to be something that so many parents would prefer. To be honest, even if they taught our kids the Swahili language, it’d be better than learning nothing. And I’m much the same as you, I talk to my eldest daughter about religion whenever she asks. The younger two haven’t had questions yet
Seeing that my boys attend a Catholic school and, not surprisingly, religious education is most definitely part of the curriculum – I can’t give you an example of what our school does!
But I can’t understand, for the life of me, why children who don’t attend scripture class can’t be given some other work to do during that time? I mean, really – how hard is it? And certainly, leaving children unattended is just unacceptable.
As for Catholics, may I just say, (and I have in mind mostly what Megan has written above) that I don’t believe my children feel forced in to learning about their religion. In our school, it’s part of their daily life there, as it is at home for most families (although, I’m sure not all). Obviously, if you send your child to a Catholic school, it’s because you not only want to give them an education, but you also want them to have a good sense of their religion, or at the very least, you understand that that will be part of their curriculum. I just want to point out to those who attended Catholic schools from 20-30 years ago – my understanding, talking to parents who attended Catholic schools themselves back then (I didn’t, as I was not raised a Catholic, but chose to become one in 1996) is that it is quite different these days. Many of the schools were run by the nuns back then, and I’ve heard some horror stories I’m afraid!
These days, Catholic education is very gentle, and subtle. It’s a very positive process, and as someone who grew up as Church of England, but never attended church until I started taking myself there – I love that my boys have an opportunity to learn about their religion. As The Suburban Princess says above, it’s actually quite an interesting subject – one I was interested in as a child but wasn’t given the opportunity to explore, hence when the opportunity presented itself, I took it at the age of 24!
So, perhaps some sort of class that covers all scriptures would be good for those children who don’t have a certain religion that they follow. But at the very least, they shouldn’t be thrown in to a room, on their own, to read a book. It’s valuable class time.
Great post. x
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I agree with you, Jodie:)
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Great to see this discussion going on in such a great forum & in such a constructive way. I’d encourage everyone who is interested in supporting the introduction of ethics classes in NSW as an option for non-scripture students in public primary schools, to join the discussion on the parents4ethics & St James Ethics Centre’s FB pages… & more importantly talk to your schools’ P&Cs about presenting a motion for voting, to add to the growing number of schools across NSW demanding a choice for their children & a change to DET’s policy. parents4ethics can help with this.
Hi Fiona, and welcome:) Thanks for sharing all the things we can do to help out. I’m part of that FB group too, it’s great to see so many people really getting behind this:)
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